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Giles
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I thought this could be of some interest – (please forgive the fact that the loco isn't narrow gauge!)

I've recently been taking a slightly different approach to weathering, where it is just 'routine' age and dirt, rather than heavy rust and decrepitude.

One of the fundamental problems with finishes on models in my opinion, is the fact that the paint -even if well applied - is actually quite rough in scale terms, and our first recourse is to coat it in varnish to impose whatever type of gloss/satin/matt finish that we want.

Nowadays I tend to go the other way, and the very first thing I do is polish the main panels of the model to get a good 'scale' finish, upon which I can then apply any weathering I want to. I think this tends to catch the light much better, and can help lift the paint-work of a RTR model, such as this Ixion Fowler, which is straight out of the box (other than the polishing and weathering.)

I flat the panels down with 2000 grit wet-and-dry (used wet) which during the process reveals all the bumps in the paint - and when it's completely flat, I then buff it up having given it a wipe with Duraglit (or similar) silver polish)



Last edited on Thu Jan 30th, 2014 11:22 am by Giles

W C Greene
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Yes, the sheen is the key. Great and very realistic finish. This loco looks like it should. Very, very, very fine.

Woodie

Rod Hutchinson
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Giles, I like the finish, but have you considered oil & grease and the dirt it captures?

ModelTrainStructures
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Very nicely done!

D.A.

Ray Dunakin
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Good idea on getting a more scale-like finish!

Giles
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Thank you - I hope it's useful... It's something I worked out when I wanted to improve the look of this car from the supplied gloss, down to a more acceptable finish.





Rod, there's no 'polish' medium left on the model to gather dust or grease, as it's all buffed off.
Once you've worked it flat with the wet and dry, it only needs a very light polish to get the paint up to this very smooth finish - and then you can weather it or do what you want.

Last edited on Fri Jan 31st, 2014 12:47 pm by Giles

Herb Kephart
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Giles-

Superb look you have created, and BTW I really like the Fowler loco as a prototype, but how do you manage to sand around all the rivets without breaking through the original finish? I know that the stock answer is "very carefully'' but there are hundreds of rivets on thet model, and I don't see any evidence of brass (or whatever the model is made of) showing through. The only way that I would even try to accomplish this would be with a soft toothbrush, and some fine abrasive paste, or liquid.Even then, I could forsee problems with breaking through the finish.

Please tell us more!


Herb


Rod Hutchinson
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Hi Giles, I have misunderstood. What you have done is get to a starting point, is that correct?

I have been using fibreglass brush where I have painted a model with gloss paint. The fibreglass brush works quite well.

Giles
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Hi Herb,

I flat with the wet-and-dry just in the main panels, and every where, avoiding the rivets - for the very reason you're saying! The next step is polishing. You can limit yourself to mostly polishing up the flatted areas, and If you do this, it leaves a fundamentally 'dirtier' loco. With the Fowler, when polishing I also polished over rivet detail, which hoes quite a long way to matching the flatted panels in replicating the overall fine appearance. On the Ivatt 2-6-0 I did less of this. It's something you can play with!

Hi Rod, yes it creates a starting point, but I think it enables you to achieve a more realistic finish overall, insofar as you are starting off with a more realistic base point.
I did use a fibreglass pen on the nooks and crannies of the car, but I don't use them on the paint on locos, as I simply want to take the surface down to flat!

The Ivatt fully weathered having had it's factory coat cut back and polished as the photo in above post

Last edited on Sat Feb 1st, 2014 08:41 am by Giles

Rod Hutchinson
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Giles, Do you think this might work for a finish such as this. It's a satin like finish on plastic.
http://www.editionsatlas.fr/collection/minisite/michelines-et-autorails/micheline-type-5.html

Giles
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In short - yes . You'll have to do it carefully, with small pieces, because of the physical size - but the properties of paint and plastic should be fundamentally the same as the Fowler.
You'll notice the difference. Do the roof also.....

Giles
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Incidentally, Herb, on the Ivatt, I did actually catch quite a few rivets, and all I did was just touch them in individually with a teeny spot of paint on a very fine brush, and it makes for an invisible fix, as the raised rivet shows differently in light anyway.

wclm
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Great look Giles. In the past it seems like we have all seen the extremes, not enough wear and tear to ready for the scrap heap. Looking at some books you can see some roads , even little ones, that took a lot of pride in the fact that they did not allow them equipment to look as if it was ready for scrap. The effects you have got are right up that alley. The same goes for some structures. Some of the weathering looks as if the buildings could hardly stand with the amount of wood grain and rust. Peeling paint is one thing and total rot is another. :moose:
 
                Clif K

Reg H
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Sorry to come late to this party...

But this is great stuff. I think that models weather to decrepitude are pretty impressive.

However, when building a layout contemporary to a specific period one needs to take into account that the equipment is going to be used and maintained.

I really like the results you are getting using this method. I am gonna try it!

Reg

Lee B
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Giles, really good work. I weathered these two diecast vehicles with no rust represented, only wear and mud. The black one especially was fun to do...

Giles
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The latest loco I've completed
It's mostly a Mercian kit, with scratch-built boiler unit in 7mm scale (1:43). Aerosol paint job, cut back and polished before weathering.

Four of these Garratts were built for use in the UK industrial railways - this model represents a fifth.

Reg H
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Wow!

Reg

Herb Kephart
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Super!

I like Garratts, both from an engineering and from an aesthetic standpoint--your loco is a perfect presentation. Just the right amount of road dirt etc.

Garratts are what American railroads should have based their locomotive developments on, instead of Mallets IMHO.

Herb

Ray Dunakin
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Wow, great work! Hard to tell it's a model!

Alwin
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What the others say above, just great! More photo's please.

Alwin.

Btw, your layouts shown in the youtube video's are great too!

wclm
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Nice work. Like the look.

Giles
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Thanks you Gents - the photography (and daylight) always helps!

This nice thing is that it's possible to get anything from a 'show-room' finish down to a rusty wreck......!





Last edited on Thu Apr 30th, 2015 01:45 pm by Giles

Herb Kephart
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Absolutely SPOT ON !!!

Herb

Herb Kephart
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A question--

And this is like someone who can't stay inside the lines on a paint-by-numbers, suggesting something to an accomplished artist,

but have you ever tried a mild abrasive (cleanser, toothpaste) on a cotton bud (Q Tip in the US) ?

Might be better in the corners, due to conformability--while kinder to the high spots ??

Herb


George W
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Wow that looks good

dennischee
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Very nice

Dennis

:moose::moose::moose::moose:

Giles
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Bless you, Herb!
I have tried a Q tip, but it only puts a shine on, whereas the effect is gained by flatting the surface (getting rid of the minute unevenness) and you need something stiffer to do that. I did make a little tool about 5mm square with 2000 grit wet-and-dry glued to it to help get into the more difficult parts.

I then tend to give the final polish with a kitchen towel (paper) for exactly the reason you suggest - because paper is mildly abrasive, and that brings up the gentle sheen.

I like to use artists water-soluble oil paints for the basic weathering - just applying small dabs on rivet lines etc, then streaking it down with a clean brush, and wiping it off (always vertically) to get the ingrained 'dirt' look.

Last edited on Thu Sep 17th, 2015 12:57 pm by Giles

Rod Hutchinson
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Hello Giles,

I have been re-reading this thread.

Would you explain how you got the finish on the connecting rods et al on the Garratt?



David P
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Hi all,

I'm a late comer to this thread as I have only just joined Freerails -
and only recently returned to modelling after a 40 year hiatus.

A preparation technique I use (suggested to me by Jerry Kits of Foothill Model Works)
is to "sandblast" kits using baking soda in an air eraser
(Jerry has an actual sandblasting cabinet that he uses for this - my cabinet is used for full size locomotive parts).

The air eraser method has the added advantage of enabling the removal of unwanted glue overruns etc.
as well as being able to get into all corners of a model.

I have an intense dislike for heavily rusted locomotives, as even those that sat in Barry scrap yard in the UK,
failed to look like some of the overdone "weathering" we see in competition and on forums.

In my own modelling I'm trying to replicate narrow gauge steam in the 1950's -
hanging in there, neglected on the VR narrow gauge
(just look at Weston Langford's photos of the Beech Forest line)
and less so on some of the industrial railways such as the Fyansford Cement Works.

At the end of the narrow gauge Whitfield line Na 15A was pretty neglected:





(above is a Haskell Na bought off eBay - weathered with custom number plates, DDC and sound)

Whilst others on timber lines like Millar Brothers in Western Australia were better looked after. 

Carriages were often not much better on the narrow gauge -
just have a look at this shot by PG Dow of the two NC vans and G41 at Crowes in 1954:





Photo references and more importantly, looking at the real thing where possible always helps
(even preserved locomotives are weathered - except perhaps in the UK!).

Oh, and Rod I used Molybond for weathering on the Na's rods -
the engine will be on Dan Pickard's display at the ANGC at Easter.


Cheers


Rod Hutchinson
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Hi David,

Do you use Molybond on the Bellarine Railway rods?  :thumb:


You should post a pic of your Blitz. 

I think readers would enjoy that too.


David P
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Hi Rod,

No molybond on the real things - would cost a fortune!
 
Just hard work to keep Pozieres' rods polished,
and the other engines have them painted
(which was pretty much the norm).

Glad you remembered the Blitz - not sure if you saw the 1:32 scale one,
which was my first weathering job that got me back into modelling. 

My best mate and former business partner had bought an unrestored Chev Blitz,
which he thought his wife didn't know about.

When he fessed up I presented him with this:
(his wife knew all along by the way)





An Italeri 1:32 kit heavily modified - with a Crow River winch
(bit large for what is supposedly 1:48 scale),
1:32 drums and bits from Tamiya, chain from Tank Workshops,
and a variety of paints and weathering powders.

The custom decals are a nod to my my mate Roy -
he's talked about getting the finished truck sign written accordingly.....

The Blitz you are possibly referring to was the 1:48 scale one I did,
from a Trax fire truck kit - originally looked like this:





And ended up like this:





The winch is from a Backwoods Miniatures Shay dress up kit, with Tamiya 1:48 drums, etc. 
Custom decals with Roy's late father's initials.

I bought a couple of these trucks and the Army version with awning for later conversions -
including one to come with a crane on the back.


Got to go - just about finished weathering 2NC to look a bit like PG Dow's photo of 5NC at Colac.


Cheers


Reg H
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Welcome to the forum, David.  

Great looking locomotive.


I am with you on "over-weathering".  
My usual initial approach is just a shot of Dullcoat. 
When I get ambitious I will very lightly airbrush on some light gray from a low angle.   

I also find that the natural accumulation of dust helps.

Reg


David P
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Hi Reg,

Glad you like the locomotive.

Unfortunately for me a spray of Dullcoat doesn't help achieve what I'm aiming for -
especially if you start off with something like a cheapy Bachmann Bumblebee in bright yellow.

This was my first foray into On30 -
a cheap well used Bumblebee bought off eBay requiring a complete dismantle and repaint
(and fitted with a TCS WowSound decoder):





Figured I would start off with something cheap to buy, so if I ruined it I wouldn't hesitate to throw it out or scrap it. 
Would have been easier if I had bought one of the other Bachmann 2-6-0's that weren't bright yellow! 
(or waited a few years and bought a new one in green with sound)

And if you kitbash or dress up a locomotive it inevitably needs an overall paint & weathering job for the new bits to "sit" properly.

This is a Bachmann Shay with a Keith Wiseman "dress up" to become a wagon top boiler "Gilpin" style locomotive -
resin boiler, lots of white metal parts and some wood:





It now has its custom "The Burra" transfers on the bunker -
this is an old shot taken back in 2016 when it was almost completed.


Cheers,


Reg H
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Yes, if you start off bright yellow, Dullcoat is not going to help much. 

Currently I am modeling HO diesels with a heavy emphasis on Great Northern. 
Lots of orange and green that I would not want to cover with a lot of weathering. 

On my previous On30 layout I did not quite get around to applying weathering. 
I will do some of that in the future. 

I really like what you have done.

Reg


elminero67
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Great looking locos!

W C Greene
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I agree, very nice work.
The new boiler certainly changes the stock "T" boiler Shay.
The 2-6-0 has a great "squatty" look, great looking lokies.

Woodie


Murray McPhie
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All those locos have what I want to try to do.
A well used but maintained appearance.

I like looking at heavily weathered stuff, some of it is brilliant!  :thumb:
But I have no idea how to start weathering locos and rolling stock without wrecking it.

I have always been the opposite.
All the equipment is clean and shiney.

Armorall dashboard protectant makes Locomotives and passenger cars look terrific!


Murray McPhie
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I have to learn a whole new skill set.

How to make stuff look like it isn't off the showroom floor!


Murray McPhie
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:bow:  :bow:

Deep respect to those who know how to do it!


David P
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Hi Murray,

As I think I mentioned earlier, I bought the Bachmann Bumblee secondhand, to try my first weathering attempts -
if I mucked it up, it could have gone in the scrap bin.

Trick is to have a go - and there is some great reference material out there such as AK Interactive's "Trainspotting"
(although I don't think much of their advice on steam locomomotive weathering).

I picked up a lot of tips from reading a stack of Fine Scale Modeller magazines that I inherited when my father-in-law passed away -
I think military modellers are probably the top of the art when it comes to weathering,
but I also like to use real reference material wherever possible
(like the photo of the Guard's Vans and Garratt I posted earlier).


This is how my van turned out:





The van is an AMK kit (local Australian manufacturer) and the locomotive a weathered and detailed commercial model (Haskell Na).

For readers outside Australia, both are models of Victorian Railway's 2'6" prototypes,
that served on the Wangarratta to Whitfield line in our state.

15A and 2NC were on the last train out of Whitfield on the February 5, 1952 -
the line closed on October 6 1953, with both on the last train from Moyhu on that day.

Buy yourself a cheapy and some paints, look at the real thing
(Victorian Goldfields Railway is often a good spot for dirty and weathered steam locomotives and carriages)
and "have a go".


Murray McPhie
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:)

Yep, the Goldfields loco's are usually very dirty.

I spent several years at the VGR volunteering on the first class passenger cars. I looked quite smart in my bow tie and waistcoat.

It was good fun, but things happened which meant I had to make some choices.

Murray McPhie
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That didn't quite come out right.

I had some family things come up.

The Goldfields Railway was and is terrific.


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